Episode 83: Time After Times

We are at EPISODE 83! And, we are wrapping up our fully remote season 3!

We recorded on June 21 and were 3 weeks into the announcement of BC’s restart plan. If our COVID numbers continue in the right direction, by the time we return in the fall, we will be back to recording in person AND many of us will be back to office life.

Many people have described these COVID times as “a great pause” or “a great reset” -- an opportunity to reflect on what really matters to us. That got us thinking...after 15+ months working from home, what might office life be like in the “AFTER” times?

Key Takeaways...for this unprecedented season:

• We are super grateful for technology that has allowed us to keep recording through the pandemic. Doing the podcast has been important for our mental health.

• We are super duper grateful that people have kept listening to us! Thank you.

• And we are extra super grateful for Kylie generously providing her editing skills each episode. We <3 Kylie!

We’ll be back in the fall! Take care!

Episode 82: Leaders Need to Show Up

We’ve talked about it before during various conversations -- the state of the world and racism, sexism, homophobia, and all the awful actions being perpetrated against people for simply being who they are have resulted in more and more businesses and organizations making efforts for equity, diversity and inclusion. 

This is important. And companies say it is important. 

And yet, it is very common that the people IN CHARGE of the business are not showing up. For sure, they have lots of responsibilities and are busy. And yet, if equity, diversity and inclusion are that important...wouldn’t they make it a priority? So, the question is, are leaders who don’t show up jerks?? Or just really, really busy?

Key Takeaways:

• Human resources can’t do this alone! 

• “Showing up” can mean a variety of things. Here are a few: 

  • Attend the important workshop! 

  • Be consistent with your values! 

  • Beyond talking about it...take action!

• Leaders are going to make mistakes. Let’s give value to what they do AFTER they know they’ve made a mistake. 

Bonus Takeaway:

• “It’s easier to solve a capacity problem than a jerk problem.” Wise words, Sarah, wise words.

Episode 81: No (Self) Doubt (Guardian Edition)

We’re back with the final Guardian episode for season 3! In the Guardian series, we’ve been focusing on the concerns and perspectives of future business and HR professionals.

This time, our Guardian is Laura Orban. Laura is a current business student at BCIT who has worked in a few fields and explored different education paths before pursuing business administration...and she has discovered she loves it!

Over the course of the last couple of seasons of DBAJAW, we’ve talked about self-doubt quite a few times and how much it impacts us and our work. It can be a total jerk! Today, we’re revisiting that topic from the perspective of someone who is educating themselves to embark on a new career, and how pervasive self-doubt is when you are thinking about how to “sell yourself” and your past experience when applying for jobs in this new career space.

Key Takeaways:

• Think about the skills you’ve gained and how you can connect the dots for the interviewer/recruiter. Prepare in advance and anticipate how to create the links that will tell the story you want to tell and communicate them in a way that shows how transferable they are!

• Don’t downplay your experience in the service industry. So many awesome skills are required in that setting...and are keenly transferable to so many environments.

• You’ll never have all the answers all of the time! It’s about how you would think about getting the answer. Resourcefulness for the WIN!!

Episode 80: The Anguishing of Languishing

Burnt out. Languishing. Unmotivated. Tired. Stuck. Many of us have had these general feelings of malaise over the past 15 months and lately...well lately, it seems even more acute.

A recurring theme that we’ve been hearing from leaders and HR professionals is that they are feeling helpless when it comes to the topic of employee burnout. They have been seeing employee burnout throughout the pandemic and supporting their teams and colleagues as best as they can. But, they are also experiencing burnout and that leaves them with a lot less capacity to lead and support others. And less capacity is typically a recipe for us inadvertently becoming jerks at work. So, what to do??

Key Takeaways:

• It is important to talk about this because it is real! Talking about it makes it more okay.

• All of us are responsible, regardless of job title, to take care and notice burnout, and that our colleague, our employee, may be languishing. 

• In spite of everything, acknowledge that work is STILL getting done! Amazing.

Episode 79: Is She Confident? Or Is She a Jerk?

We’ve talked about imposter syndrome (aka newbie nerves, productive discomfort) and today we are talking about something a little different. While we have noticed that more women in leadership are feeling worthy AND welcome AND confident and not like imposters at all, we still self-edit our words and actions because we worry our confidence will be judged negatively.

So in this episode, we consider the question: why do so many confident and successful women leaders worry that their confidence and success is making them look like jerks at work?

Key Takeaways:

• There is a difference between confidence and arrogance.

• Adaptability is a valuable skill. At the same time, being too adaptable can lead to self-editing, being a chameleon, and a loss of self.

• Be brave! Be confident! And lift others up with you.

*In this episode, we noted the work of leaders Rachel Cargle, Glennon Doyle, Liz Plank, and Tara’s pal Fiona Proctor. Thank you to all of them!

Episode 78: My Boss is a Jerk! (Guardian Edition)

This is our 4th episode in our DBAJAW Guardian series – a series of episodes focusing on the concerns and perspectives of future business and HR professionals. We call them the guardians because they are the next generation that will strive to keep the jerkiness down at work.

Our Guardian this time around is Amrit Humpal, a 2nd year student in the British Columbia Institute of Technology Human Resources Management Program. Amrit talks with us about what makes a boss NOT a jerk, and how that’s an important factor in deciding where he’ll work in the future. Besides being passionate about HR and positive work environments, Amrit is also VERY passionate about the Vancouver Canucks. 

Key Takeaways:

• Good boss traits include compassion and empathy -- a boss that recognizes when their team member may be having a hard time.

• Also...recognizing when their team members are doing a great job! Not taking it (and them!) for granted.

• When assessing whether or not you want to approach your boss about a difficult behaviour they are exhibiting (scary situation!!), motivate yourself by focusing on the positive that could come out of it! Nothing will change if you say nothing.

Bonus Takeaway:

• The next gen is generation Alpha! Born between 2010 and 2024. Wow.

Episode 77: Time for Some Feedback on Feedback

We learn and grow when we know how we are doing, and, for most of us, our go-to method for figuring out how we are doing is to rely on the feedback of others. Still, many of us generally find giving and receiving feedback uncomfortable. How come? And, does it have something to do with the word itself??

Key Takeaways:

• There are differences between criticism and feedback, and one of the key differences is context. We need context!

• If you are asking for feedback, be specific about what you want feedback on.

• Feedback is so one-way! It feels like you just have to sit there and take it. It’s time to reframe feedback as a conversation.

Bonus Takeaway:

• While we all love sandwiches...no more sh$t sandwiches! Take the bread off and get to the point.

Episode 76: Bringing Your Whole Self to Work

*Tech note: our sound is more hollow than usual in this episode. Endeavouring to improve for next time!*

One of the biggest shifts that we have noticed during these COVID times is the acceptance and understanding that employees have personal lives outside of work. Before COVID, many of us would be mortified if our child or pet made a peep (or even worse, appeared) in the background of a video call; we wouldn’t dream of wearing the same sweatshirt to work three days in a row, and we would feel uncomfortable saying that we had to wrap up a call to attend to a personal matter.

And then COVID-19 happened. Suddenly we all seemed to be more understanding of one another’s personal situations, and in fact, the appearance of the pet is often the meeting highlight!

That got us thinking about work personas and how much we bring of ourselves to the workplace.

Key Takeaways:

• “Bringing our whole selves to work” is relative! Individuals are going to be more or less open depending on their personalities, their feeling of safety, their cultural backgrounds, self-confidence in their abilities, etc. 

• It’s important to think about what is defined as “professional” and whether or not it needs a rewrite. (Yes, yes it does.)

• And still, showing up as your whole self can make you look like a jerk! Watch out for the over-share. Don’t make it all about you...intention doesn’t mitigate impact.

Episode 75: COVID is a Jerk! (Guardian Edition)

Our latest episode is the 3rd in our DBAJAW Guardian series… our series of episodes focusing on the concerns and perspectives of future business and HR professionals. We call them the guardians because they are the next generation that will strive to keep the jerkiness down at work.

This conversation’s guest co-host, Nura Salous, is a current student at Concordia University of Edmonton, she loves pasta, and due to the time difference, she made the HUGE effort to record with us at 6am her time! Thank you, Nura!!

While we have talked a lot about COVID-19 and how the global pandemic has impacted our working lives, with Nura we tackle it from the perspective of a university student.

Key Takeaways:

• Necessity forced the building of some new skills -- learning how to cope with uncertainty and how to adapt to change.

• The resilience we develop during this time will translate well into workplaces! We’ll face challenges every day, just like now, and be able to tackle them with more confidence. 

• The pandemic experience makes us realize the day-to-day things we took for granted that now we miss -- even walking in the freezing cold to class!

Episode 74: This is Still Hard - A Pandemic Lament

Look. For many people, it’s been a long year (yes, a YEAR!) of very little face to face and much more screen to screen. Through it all, we have tried to adapt in various ways. Some of these ways have proven to be more successful than others. But no matter what, we still find ourselves saying: this stuff is hard. Really HARD. (Okay, two of us are saying it more than the other!) By stuff we mean communicating. Connecting. Keeping up relationships over a screen. Having a solid read on things. Working as a team. Feeling like a team.

In this episode, we (two of us more than the other!) get to whine and bemoan and grieve and complain about all the things we miss about having a proper sit down with a person and being in a workplace, and actually interacting with other humans there.  

Key Takeaways:

• We miss the real vibe of shared energy that happens when a bunch of people are in the same space. That feeling when a whole room of people start to laugh about something...and then just can’t stop. :)

• Sandy is happy to not have people regularly ask her, “Oh, hey, do you have a minute??” (Which really means 30 minutes.) We feel you, Sandy.

• Who knows!? Maybe the pandemic will lead to a real change in the bra business! No more underwire ever!!

Episode 73: Mirror Mirror

Lately, it seems that we have had a lot more time to be introspective. Maybe it’s because of COVID (for sure, it is partially related to COVID), maybe it is because of the general state of the world… Who knows? What we do know… is that introspection and self-reflection generally lead to self-awareness, and self-awareness hopefully reduces jerkiness at work! In other words, when it comes to not being a jerk at work, it all starts with YOU! And US! (Not just you. We need the mirror, too!)

Key Takeaways:

• Reflection is thinking...about...something. 🤔 How is that for descriptive??

• If you notice you generally reflect during challenging times, try doing it when something has gone really well, too!

• It’s okay to be uncomfortable when we self-reflect. Keep looking anyway! Practice, practice, practice.

Episode 72: Be Prepared!

This episode is the 2nd in our DBAJAW Guardian series --  our series of episodes focusing on the concerns and perspectives of future business and HR professionals. We call them the guardians because they are the next generation that will strive to keep the jerkiness down at work. In this discussion, we talk with Guardian Maggie Majerova, a student at Concordia University of Edmonton, about how prepared / unprepared students and new grads feel about starting their first career job and what they are doing about that. Big thank you to Maggie for showing up as her true self and sharing her experience and her feelings about the future!

Key Takeaways:

• Make the most of internship and co-op opportunities. These help fill in the practical knowledge gaps that can’t help but exist in educational programs.

• Think about how to reframe concerns -- ask yourself questions that can help you take your concerns and identify new ways to approach building confidence The fake-it-to-you-make-it approach might be your friend!

• Keep learning! Stay curious! In addition to the program at university or college, there are other ways to add to your education: networks, community, podcasts (that’s us!!), reading, etc. 

Bonus Takeaway:

• Misconceptions of Gen Z? That they don’t want to work hard or for anyone else. Rather, they want to work with organizations that focus on development and sustainability, where they can show up as their true selves, and for and with leaders who want to make a difference.

Episode 71: Toxic Positivity at Work

We thought it would be a strong contrast to follow up our gratitude episode with one on toxic positivity. Before we could even get into a discussion on this topic, we had to get clear on what the heck it is! Our nutshell definition goes something like this: glazing over or ignoring the crappiness of a situation and not acknowledging how hard something might be, and how negatively it may be impacting someone, a team or a company. Often, it’s combined with a lot of finding-of-silver-linings, something that the three of us, who lean towards being positive, are prone to do. We’ve got some contrasting points of view this time! At least we are still friends though. (See what we did there?) :)

Key Takeaways:

• One thing we all agreed on is that, at first, the notion of this made us mega eyerolllllll.

• Don’t pretend the tough stuff isn’t happening! If you’ve got crappy news to share with your team, be up front about it, having an authentic conversation, and then move to solution-finding.

• Positivity and platitudes are going to impact people in really different ways, and, as always, positive intention doesn’t mitigate impact. Three things to keep in mind: topic, timing, audience.

Episode 70: Gre-Attitude? Grrr-Attitude? What’s Your Attitude About Gratitude?

Are you a glass half full, silver lining, always-look-on-the-bright-side kind of person? Are you good at turning towards what you have? Does practicing gratitude come naturally to you? Or, are you someone who thinks that they could be better at feeling grateful for what you have? Or, are you someone who thinks that this gratitude stuff is way too woo woo for you? 

The three of us generally trend towards the optimistic and grateful side of the spectrum. But gratitude can be tricky. In this episode we discuss the paradoxical nature of gratitude: sometimes it serves us AND sometimes it might just lead us to tolerating more than we should. Conundrum? Yes, we think so.

PS: This episode was recorded in early November 2020.

Oh! And we kick off the episode with a quick statement of our guiding words/phrases for 2021.

Sandy: Reflection and Celebration
Sarah: Roll with It!
Tara: Lift

Key Takeaways:

• What’s the motivation to express gratitude? Is it a grounding practice? Is it to shift perspective? Is it about recognition of another? Or is it about connection?

• It’s possible that the pressure to be grateful (externally or internally applied) can lead us to inauthenticity, or to stay in situations that are less than awesome.

• There isn’t a templated way of expressing gratitude that works for all. Singing gorillas are not a one-size-fits-all approach. :)

Episode 69: Hindsight is 2020...Our Word of the Year Recap

It’s that time! We reflect on the words we had identified to guide us through 2020. Needless to say, this year really wasn’t what any of us expected. Did the words hold up?? 

These were our 2020 words (or, in the case of Sarah, phrases!):

Tara - LEVITY
Sarah - YOU’RE IN A FIELD
Sandy - CREATE

Sarah and Sandy already have their phrases and words for 2021! Tara, not so much. (Not a surprise.) 

And, Happy New Year! Thank you for listening.

Episode 68: Everyone is a Leader to Someone

Has anyone ever said anything to you that has just stuck? That definitely happened to us when our good friend and co-host, Tara Kemes, casually said one day, “Everyone is a leader to someone.” That was probably 3 years ago and since that time, this phrase has been repeated and used by us many times. Thank you Tara for those inspiring words and for inspiring our episode topic for today.

In this episode, we unpack our thoughts on what leadership is and how that definition has changed for us over time. We also talk about the limiting beliefs (from ourselves or others) that hold us back from being the leader we want to be. And then of course, we talk about ways to push back on those limiting beliefs.

Key Takeaways:

• Lead by example! Every time you make the choice to be a better workplace human, you give permission for someone else to do the same.

• Use these COVID times as an opportunity to practice being the leader you want to be.

• Leadership can happen anytime, anywhere, and everyday.

• Don’t worry about making mistakes and being perfect. Get back up and keep going, even if it feels kinda crappy on some days.

Episode 67: Holidaze

Most of us who have the privilege to be able to keep our jobs (and are likely working from home) during this global pandemic feel pretty damn lucky. Many who are working from home even prefer it! But with the holidays approaching, it got us thinking about the parties we are going to miss out on this year -- the ones we liked going to, and the ones, as HR, we hated planning. This year, it is a different conversation and it goes something like this: how are we, as leaders, supposed to create meaningful conditions of connection this year? How do we celebrate together without overwhelming each other? What kind of connection do our people need or expect? Great. This planning seems EVEN harder than chicken, fish or vegan!

Key Takeaways:

• Find ways to provide different options for people to participate, so it’s not simply another large virtual gathering. Maybe it’s an opportunity to try something new that always got ex-nayed in the past.

• If you are organizing a company holiday activity, make it truly optional! That also means no judgy judgerson if employees don’t show up.

• As the pandemic and the safety protocols have continued, we just may miss the holiday party more than we anticipated. Bah, COVIDbug.

Holiday Bonus Takeaway:

• Sarah makes delicious Nanaimo Bars!! She uses sea salt on the top...amazing!

Episode 66: No Pressure (Guardian Series)

We mentioned at the beginning of the season that we are trying some new things! We are excited to introduce our DBAJAW Guardian series where we focus on the perspectives of future business and HR professionals. We call them the guardians because they are the next generation that will strive to keep the jerkiness down at work. Goooo guardians!

We are also excited to share the mic with our first guardian, Christie Sage Reddy. Christie is a current student in the human resources program at Kwantlen Polytechnic University, and she was brave enough to sit down and have a conversation with us about how she’s feeling about embarking on her HR career. (Thanks for joining us, Christie!)

It’s been a minute (okay, a lot of years) since we started our careers and it is safe to say that there are a lot of things that a) we don’t remember and b) have completely changed. That said, one feeling that might be consistent across generations is the PRESSURE to find that first career job. Oof.

Key Takeaways:

• While a first job may not be perfect, it’s highly likely that there is still something to be gained from the experience. (As long as it isn’t a terrible workplace!)

• It’s not just about the right job, it’s about the right company, too! Does the company have values that align with yours? And then the company needs to actually follow through on them.

• Keep goals in mind! Reflect. Ask yourself: in a year from now, will this opportunity have taken you closer to your goals? (Also note, your goals are likely to change over time!!)

Episode 65: Don't Make Me (m)Ask You Again!

In this episode, we are visiting the topic of the pandemic, again. Because, let’s be real, it’s our reality! And it significantly impacts E-V-E-R-Y-T-H-I-N-G.

We are so happy to have a guest with us...someone whose job has really morphed as a result of COVID-19. Sara Martin joins us to speak about what it’s been like to take on the responsibility of COVID safety protocols in the workplace. Co-workers commit (mostly unintentional) COVID jerky offenses, and then the COVID officer feels like a jerk having to call them out on them! It feels like a bit of a lose-lose scenario! Sheesh. All that to say that, over the past several months, whether it be about masks or hand-washing, Sara has been overheard saying, oh, just a few times, “Don’t make me ask you again!” 

Key Takeaways:

• Because this, the pandemic, is a new experience, every decision may feel awkward! And you might feel uncomfortable because you don’t know the answers. These are normal feelings!

• Adaptability is the name of the game. Be ready to pivot quickly and frequently.

• It’s okay to cry, and cry often.

And...an extra one for this episode:

• Being the “COVID officer” is an important job! And yet, it doesn’t always get a ton of enthusiastic, sincere gratitude. So, to all people doing this work in workplaces...THANK YOU!!!!!

Episode 64: Arrested Development

*We had some connectivity issues at the start of this episode that affected the sound quality. Thanks for bearing with us! Clears up after the first several minutes.*

Are you feeling stuck? Many of us have taken the eye off our own learning and development in place of coping and just surviving in such uncertain times. Some of us may be feeling this more than ever due to COVID while others may have been feeling this way their whole working lives. How do we start (or restart) those conversations with our employers about investing in developing ourselves and our teams?

Key Takeaways:

• YOU (as an employee) are the main person responsible for driving your own learning and development.

• For both employees and employers...be aware of capacity! What can people realistically take on these days?

• Learning and development doesn’t just come from classes and training programs. Podcasts, books, discussions! Be curious! (Our favourite suggestion.) :)